An interventional study of Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture material and Non-absorbable Nylon Suture Material in Laceration of Hand and Laceration of Forearm, sponsored by Kenneth Taylor, M.D.. Terminated at 1 site in United States. Open to participants aged 18 Years and older. Per ClinicalTrials.gov, last updated 2026-03-17.
Sponsored by Kenneth Taylor, M.D. · Not applicable, Interventional, and Treatment
Among 60 studies in Lacerations with a site in United States — 12 open to participants now, 14 under way, 1 of them phase 3. Lacerations · United States.
Among the 60 studies in Lacerations with a site in United States, this one is the 42nd largest by enrollment of the 52 interventional ones, is one of 3 that started in 2022, is one of 33 with no phase, and was the 44th registered.
174 studies on the registry are indexed under Lacerations; 43 are open to participants now.
This study's enrollment of 6 is below the median of 65 across 128 interventional studies indexed under Lacerations.
Browse Lacerations studies →12 of the 60 studies in Lacerations with a site in United States are open now, in 1 country. Each count lists the studies.
Of the 27 Lacerations studies recruiting now, 15 (56%) set no upper age limit and 10 (37%) stop at 75 or younger; 6 take children under 18; 9 take healthy volunteers.
This study: 18 Years and older · all sexes · no healthy volunteers.
The full table on the hub →60 studies; the count open now beside each. This study's row is marked.
First in 2000; this study’s year is marked. 3 started in 2022.
Median enrollment 52 across the 52 interventional studies, 50 across the 7 observational. Of the 36 that completed or were terminated, 18 (50%) have results posted.
8 of 60 have an industry lead sponsor. The 10 most frequent:
Kenneth Taylor, M.D. is the lead sponsor of 3 studies on the registry; none are open to participants now.
Kenneth Taylor, M.D. has 1 study filed under Lacerations — fewer than ten, so there is no comparison to draw.
6 of the studies in Lacerations with a site in United States that are under way reach primary completion within a year, 1 of them phase 3. Phase 3 first, then by date:
| Study | Primary completion |
|---|---|
| NCT06910241Phase 3Florida Atlantic UniversityLidocaine Versus Diphenhydramine to Achieve Local Anesthesia for Laceration Repairs | 2027-06-30 |
| NCT07606625University of California, BerkeleyOcular Surface Health and Tear Film Stability With a Nasal Spray Dry Eye Treatment | 2026-12-31 |
| NCT07068880Brett LewellynClinical Analysis of a Novel Flexor Tendon Repair Technique | 2027-01 |
| NCT07632183Edward Via Virginia College of Osteopathic MedicineWill a Hands on Technique Applied to the Face Increase the Tear Production in Participants | 2027-06 |
| NCT07688967Arthroresearch LLCMeasuring Knee Laxity and Pivot Shift in ACL-Deficient Patients | 2027-07 |
Among the 60 studies in Lacerations with a site in United States, from their registry updates:
This study aims to determine whether the use of non-absorbable (i.e. nylon) versus absorbable (i.e. chromic gut) sutures in traumatic hand lacerations affects wound healing, patient perception, and development of complications.
There has been limited data published on suture type in traumatic hand wounds. The only study we found in our literature review was a retrospective study comparing vicryl vs. nylon suture and found no difference in scar appearance, tenderness, retraction, or complications as far as 6 months after repair (2). There have been no prospective studies on this topic. The theoretical advantage of absorbable suture for these wounds is they do not require suture removal, thereby removing the discomfort of suture removal as well potentially decreasing the burden of follow-up.
At the Penn State Health Hershey Medical Center, either suture choice included in this study is considered standard of care and is routinely used. Selection as to whether absorbable or non-absorbable suture is used is based on the preference and discretion of the resident and attending surgeon involved in the patient care. As such, if a patient were to present to the emergency department with a forearm or hand laceration and hand surgery were consulted, regardless of whether the patient opts to participate in this research study, their laceration would be repaired with either absorbable or non-absorbable suture depending on provider preference and the patient would be scheduled follow-up.
There have been multiple prospective clinical trials on suture type in the context of planned surgical incisions, specifically carpal tunnel release, with variable outcomes. One clinical trial looking at a total of 40 incisions found no difference in pain, tenderness, inflammation, or outcomes postoperatively (3). Certain clinical trials favored non-absorbable sutures, reporting a higher rate of infection (4) or inflammation (5) with vicryl suture as compared to non-braided, non-absorbable sutures. On the other hand, other clinical trials favored absorbable sutures, describing reduction in pain scores (6) and pain associated with absorbable suture removal in the setting of other equivalent outcomes (7).
The purpose of the study is to evaluate the use of absorbable and non-absorbable suture material in hand lacerations repaired in the Penn State Health Milton S. Hershey Emergency Department.
Go through the criteria one by one — yes, no or not sure — and take the list to your doctor or the study team. Kept in this browser only.
Exclusion Criteria:
Underlined terms in the criteria open these too. Explained by clinicaltrials.gg, not part of the registry record. The study team decides who can take part.
Before you join, the study team explains what taking part involves — its purpose, what happens, the risks and possible benefits — and answers your questions, so you can decide freely. Consent is usually recorded on a form (the informed consent form, ICF) signed by you or, where the law allows, by someone legally authorised to decide for you.
You can keep asking questions during the study, you are told of new information that matters, and you can choose to leave at any time.
A weakened immune system. It can come from an illness, such as HIV or some blood cancers, or from medicines that turn the immune system down, for example after an organ transplant or for an autoimmune disease; steroids at higher doses count.
Read whether the line is about a condition or about medicines, and which medicines and doses it means.
Anti-inflammatory medicines such as prednisone, prednisolone and dexamethasone — not the anabolic steroids used for muscle.
Studies differ in what they allow: check which steroid medicines, routes (tablets, injections, creams, inhalers, eye drops) and doses this study accepts.
Informed consent
Before you join, the study team explains what taking part involves — its purpose, what happens, the risks and possible benefits — and answers your questions, so you can decide freely. Consent is usually recorded on a form (the informed consent form, ICF) signed by you or, where the law allows, by someone legally authorised to decide for you.
You can keep asking questions during the study, you are told of new information that matters, and you can choose to leave at any time.
Explained by clinicaltrials.gg, not part of the registry record. The study team decides who can take part.
Immunosuppression
A weakened immune system. It can come from an illness, such as HIV or some blood cancers, or from medicines that turn the immune system down, for example after an organ transplant or for an autoimmune disease; steroids at higher doses count.
Read whether the line is about a condition or about medicines, and which medicines and doses it means.
Explained by clinicaltrials.gg, not part of the registry record. The study team decides who can take part.
Corticosteroids (steroids)
Anti-inflammatory medicines such as prednisone, prednisolone and dexamethasone — not the anabolic steroids used for muscle.
Studies differ in what they allow: check which steroid medicines, routes (tablets, injections, creams, inhalers, eye drops) and doses this study accepts.
Explained by clinicaltrials.gg, not part of the registry record. The study team decides who can take part.
Ethicon Chromic Surgical Gut Suture Is an absorbable, sterile surgical suture composed of purified connective tissue (mostly collagen) derived from either the serosal layer of beef (bovine) or the submucosal fibrous layer of sheep (ovine) Intestines. Surgical Gut Suture is Indicated for use In general soft tissue approximation and/or ligation, including use In ophthalmic procedures, but not for use in cardiovascular and neurologic tissues.
Device: Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture material
Ethicon ETHILON\* nylon suture is a nonabsorbab\\e, sterile surgical monofi\\ament suture composed of the long-chain aliphatic polymers Nylon 6 and Nylon 6,6. ETHILON sutures are dyed black or green to enhance visibility in tissue. The suture is also available undyed (clear). ETHILON suture is indicated for use in general soft tissue approximation and/or ligation, including use in cardiovascular, ophthalmic and neurological procedures.
Device: Non-absorbable Nylon Suture Material
Participants with lacerations below the level of the forearm that meet inclusion criteria and are consented and randomized to this group will undergo washout and laceration repair using absorbable surgical gut suture material. They will be sent home with antibiotics. They will be asked to return to the outpatient hand clinic at 2, 6, and 12 weeks follow-up. Their wound will be assessed by a single observer, utilizing the POSAS and VAS.
Participants with lacerations below the level of the forearm that meet inclusion criteria and are consented and randomized to this group will undergo washout and laceration repair using non-absorbable nylon gut suture material. They will be sent home with antibiotics. They will be asked to return to the outpatient hand clinic at 2, 6, and 12 weeks follow-up. Their sutures will be removed at the 2-week follow-up visit. Their wound will be assessed by a single observer, utilizing the POSAS and VAS.
Score in Wound Healing From Surgery to 2 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Patient Portion
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
Time frame: 2 weeks post-laceration repair
Score in Wound Healing From Surgery 6 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Patient Portion
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
Time frame: 6 weeks post-laceration repair
Score in Wound Healing From Surgery 12 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Patient Portion
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
Time frame: 12 weeks post-laceration repair
Score in Wound Healing From Surgery to 2 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Observer Portion
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
Time frame: 2 weeks post-laceration repair
Score in Wound Healing From Surgery 6 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Observer Portion
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
Time frame: 6 weeks post-laceration repair
Score in Wound Healing From Surgery 12 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Observer Portion
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
Time frame: 12 weeks post-laceration repair
Patient Reported Pain Using the Visual Analog Scale (VAS) at 2-weeks
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the VAS Analog Scale. The VAS is a validated, subjective tool for measuring pain intensity, typically consisting of a 10-cm (100-mm) horizontal line anchored by "no pain"(0) and "worst possible pain" (10). Adults mark their pain level on this line, and the distance from the left is measured to determine the score.
Time frame: 2 weeks post-laceration repair
Patient Reported Pain Using the Visual Analog Scale (VAS) at 6-weeks
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the VAS Analog Scale. The VAS is a validated, subjective tool for measuring pain intensity, typically consisting of a 10-cm (100-mm) horizontal line anchored by "no pain"(0) and "worst possible pain" (10). Adults mark their pain level on this line, and the distance from the left is measured to determine the score.
Time frame: 6 weeks post-laceration repair
Patient Reported Pain Using the Visual Analog Scale (VAS) at 12-weeks
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the VAS Analog Scale. The VAS is a validated, subjective tool for measuring pain intensity, typically consisting of a 10-cm (100-mm) horizontal line anchored by "no pain"(0) and "worst possible pain" (10). Adults mark their pain level on this line, and the distance from the left is measured to determine the score.
Time frame: 12 weeks post-laceration repair
Participants were recruited during their clinical encounter in the Emergency Room at an academic medical center. The first participant was enrolled on 8/23/2022 and the final patient enrolled on 9/24/2022. The study was kept open for enrollment until 2025 when PI decided to close it due to lack of enrollment.
| Milestone | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Started | 4 | 2 |
| Completed | 3 | 1 |
| Not completed | 1 | 1 |
| Withdrew: Withdrawal by subject | 1 | 0 |
| Withdrew: Lost to follow-up | 0 | 1 |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Score in Wound Healing From Surgery to 2 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Patient Portion | 25 ± 11.8 | 24 ± 2.8 |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Score in Wound Healing From Surgery 6 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Patient Portion | 12 ± 5.3 | — |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Score in Wound Healing From Surgery 12 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Patient Portion | 9 ± 4.4 | 9 ± 0 |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Score in Wound Healing From Surgery to 2 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Observer Portion | 23 ± 10.5 | 22.5 ± 7.8 |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Score in Wound Healing From Surgery 6 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Observer Portion | 13.3 ± 7.5 | — |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS). The assigned blinded observer also completes this survey. Scores are obtained from both the subject and observer at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks. The Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS) evaluates scars and consists of two 6-item, 10-point scales (1 = normal skin, 10 = worst scar imaginable) for both patients and observers. Scores for each scale range from 6 to 60, where higher scores indicate poorer scar quality. Both scales include an overall opinion item, which is not included in the sum score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Score in Wound Healing From Surgery 12 Weeks Follow-up as Measured Using the Patient and Observer Scar Assessment Scale (POSAS)-Observer Portion | 14.3 ± 13.6 | 12 ± 0 |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the VAS Analog Scale. The VAS is a validated, subjective tool for measuring pain intensity, typically consisting of a 10-cm (100-mm) horizontal line anchored by "no pain"(0) and "worst possible pain" (10). Adults mark their pain level on this line, and the distance from the left is measured to determine the score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Patient Reported Pain Using the Visual Analog Scale (VAS) at 2-weeks | 1.9 ± 0.8 | 2.8 ± 2.6 |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the VAS Analog Scale. The VAS is a validated, subjective tool for measuring pain intensity, typically consisting of a 10-cm (100-mm) horizontal line anchored by "no pain"(0) and "worst possible pain" (10). Adults mark their pain level on this line, and the distance from the left is measured to determine the score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Patient Reported Pain Using the Visual Analog Scale (VAS) at 6-weeks | 0.48 ± 0.6 | — |
Patients return to the practice site at 2 weeks, 6 weeks, and 12 weeks after their initial visit to the Emergency Department and complete the VAS Analog Scale. The VAS is a validated, subjective tool for measuring pain intensity, typically consisting of a 10-cm (100-mm) horizontal line anchored by "no pain"(0) and "worst possible pain" (10). Adults mark their pain level on this line, and the distance from the left is measured to determine the score.
| score on a scale | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture |
|---|---|---|
| Patient Reported Pain Using the Visual Analog Scale (VAS) at 12-weeks | 0.033 ± 0.06 | 1 ± 0 |
Collected over 12 weeks. Non-serious events are listed at a 0% frequency threshold.
| Group | Deaths | Serious | Other |
|---|---|---|---|
| Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | 0/4 (0%) | 0/4 (0%) | 0/4 (0%) |
| Non-absorbable Nylon Suture | 0/2 (0%) | 0/2 (0%) | 0/2 (0%) |
| Age, Categorical(Participants) | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| <=18 years | 0 | 0 | 0 |
| Between 18 and 65 years | 1 | 2 | 3 |
| >=65 years | 3 | 0 | 3 |
| Sex: Female, Male(Participants) | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| Female | 2 | 1 | 3 |
| Male | 2 | 1 | 3 |
| Race and Ethnicity Not Collected(Participants) | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| Count of participants | — | — | 0 |
| Region of Enrollment(participants) | Absorbable Surgical Gut Suture | Non-absorbable Nylon Suture | Total |
|---|---|---|---|
| United States | 4 | 2 | 6 |
PDFs hosted by the registry, ClinicalTrials.gov.
Plan to share: No
Ran from Aug 2022 to primary completion in Dec 2022, 3 months.
Results were first posted in Mar 2026, 3 years 2 months after primary completion.
How these figures are worked out, and which studies are left out of them.
This study is terminated, as verified in May 2025. You cannot join it, but the record below documents what was studied.
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